How to Empower Your Clients Through Boudoir Photography with Tina Meerloo

Pat Miller: 00:00

I'm Pat Miller, and this is The Professional Photographer podcast. Today we get to talk about boudoir photography. And every time I interview someone about it, I learn something new. This is a complex style that has so many benefits for the subjects that participate in it and for the photographers that take those images. On today's show, we're talking about boudoir photography as a tool for healing. Now, clients come in for all different reasons, and they do a different range of shoots. But as a photographer, you're building trust with them, you're understanding the goals that they're trying to get out of the session, and then you're offering this experience that happens to be a photo shoot. On today's show, Tina Meerloo is going to tell us all about how powerful this style is, her experience of helping women and men get their boudoir sessions done, and why we as an industry need to spend more time talking about how impactful boudoir photography can be. Tina Meerloo is standing by. We'll talk to her next. Tina, welcome to The Professional Photographer podcast. How are you today?

Christina "Tina" Meerloo: 01:16

I am so good. I'm really excited to be here.

Pat Miller: 01:19

I'm excited that you're here today too, because first of all, we had a really fun pre-interview and we get to talk about a really important topic. Boudoir is a tool for healing. But before we get to that, if someone hasn't met you yet, tell us who you are and what you do.

Christina "Tina" Meerloo: 01:35

My name is Christina, or as I like to be known, Tina Meerloo. I am a boudoir photographer based in New Jersey. I travel all over the world to do what I do, and I'm super passionate about making spaces for women that are safe and empowering. And that has sort of bled over into my work in the photography world because I love to make spaces there too.

Pat Miller: 02:06

So let's start at the beginning. How did you discover that boudoir is a tool for healing?

Christina "Tina" Meerloo: 02:12

So I think the way that that happened is just by me being able to recognize the patterns. And by that, I mean when my clients would come in and have this experience with me, I would see their self-confidence change in real time. It was an experience and a thing that happened over and over again. A client would come in, they would be shy, I would hold space for them, I would create space for them in which to be themselves. And by the end of the session, they would be another person. They would be a different, more empowered version of themselves. And I think that I just really loved that part of boudoir from the beginning.

Pat Miller: 03:04

How does someone come up with the idea that they're going to do a boudoir session when they may have some reservations? What is driving them to make the decision to do it? Even when from the sounds of it, it sounds like they're not fully ready to be a part of the session upon entry. So what's drawing them to do boudoir?

Christina "Tina" Meerloo: 03:22

First of all, we're doing the hard thing, right? We're doing–we're stepping out of our comfort zones. And that is very scary, but empowering. And I think a lot of my clients see the value in that. But also before they ever step through the door, I am being very honest and open about what I do online and on my social media. I am always talking about doing the scary thing and putting myself out there. And I think in making myself such a big part of my brand, I am creating a space online where women feel seen and heard by me without ever seeing me in person. And I think that's a big part of boudoir.

Pat Miller: 04:12

And people have a hang up sometimes of just getting a headshot taken. There's a lot more than a headshot. I had my headshot session done recently by my wife, who's a photographer, and I was nervous about it for days in advance. I can't imagine doing a session like this. It's a unique part of boudoir. But is this where there's so much stored up energy, where some of the power comes from?

Christina "Tina" Meerloo: 04:35

I believe so. I do believe that stepping out in front of a camera and being in your underwear or being in a dress that maybe is hugging your curves or a pair of pants that's hugging your curves, or it can be scary, but it can also be an act of reclamation where you decide who looks at your body and you decide what your body is doing in these images. And that is very empowering.

Pat Miller: 05:13

You talked about how important it is for you to build trust that people walk in and they have–everyone's got their hangups, but they have their hangups. They're getting ready to do a session that they probably have never done before. So how do you start the process of building trust? You mentioned being real and vulnerable on your social media, but what else do you do to communicate with them both out loud and inferred that you're someone that they can trust with this session?

Christina "Tina" Meerloo: 05:42

Absolutely. Okay, so I think that this starts first of all by having an amazing hair and makeup team. I cannot explain to you or I can't explain how important it is to have a great team that makes your client feel comfortable from the second they walk in the door, they're sitting for an hour and a half through makeup. They're talking. We are building a rapport with them in real time. And it is so important that you have a great team that makes them super comfortable. So by the time their hair and makeup is done, they're just slightly a little bit more brave. Right? And then I will pull them into the studio, and I'll sit down on the couch with them, and I ask them a series of questions. What are your goals? How do you want to feel? And also, what level of sexiness or modesty are you comfortable with? Right? Because that is so important. It's not the same for everyone. And part of my job is to make space for all levels of sensuality.

Pat Miller: 06:58

It's got to be an interesting conversation, especially the first few times you had it. Is this a learning process for you as the photographer to know exactly how to approach these subjects and when someone says, "Well, I don't know." To gently guide them to their limit and not surpass it?

Christina "Tina" Meerloo: 07:16

Absolutely. That is probably why I would call this a therapeutic art experience because so much importance lies in how the boudoir photographer is speaking and the words that they use. Right? Language is so important. And my goal, and every boudoir photographer's goal really, is to make clients feel really comfortable and make them feel like they can say, "Hey, maybe this is too much," or, "Hey, you know what? I think I can take this–we can bring this to the next level."

Pat Miller: 07:57

How do you identify where they're at? Obviously, they will share, but what are some of the unspoken things that you noticed? Does anything come up that makes you go, oh, I can do this pose? And, oh, I bet they would really like this style. Are there any tips or tricks that you've noticed through your years of experience that maybe a beginner wouldn't notice?

Christina "Tina" Meerloo: 08:16

Yes, But I would say that I don't like to let many things go unspoken because it's really, really important to me that my clients feel heard. So, honestly, the first thing that I do when I start talking to my clients about posing is that I will get onto the ground, and I will put my body in a pose that is not too overt, and I will say, okay, we can shoot poses like this, and then I will switch my body into the same sort of pose, but a little sexier. And I will say, or we can shoot like this. What level of sensuality are you looking for? Are you comfortable with? Because I want them to really say and really know that the poses that I'm putting them in are like a full body yes. Like a, okay, this is, like, a little more than I was hoping for. But I'm just gonna do it because she's telling me to do it, and she knows what she's talking about. It's not about me. It's completely about the client.

Pat Miller: 09:27

The camera can tell when they're not comfortable, right?

Christina "Tina" Meerloo: 09:31

It absolutely can, and so can I.

Pat Miller: 09:34

You talk about grounding your clients, helping them get grounded into their body. You do this posing. Are there other methods that you use to make them feel present and comfortable so the camera doesn't lie and it notices how they're feeling and you get the good stuff.

Christina "Tina" Meerloo: 09:48

Yeah. I think, you know, in that first conversation with my clients, I'm definitely going to do some breathing, and I'm definitely going to say, like, hey, let's just drop into our bodies for a second. How are you feeling? I understand that you're nervous, and I will essentially just speak with them like, they're my best friend, you know, because when it comes down to it, I'm just a woman trying to–usually, most of my clients are women, not all, but I am just a woman holding space for another human. And I want them to feel really comfortable and really heard in that space.

Pat Miller: 10:34

The episode's titled Boudoir is a Tool for Healing. What are some of the things that you're helping people heal in your experience? Have you had people–I just can't imagine some of the things that people are overcoming by working with you. Can you give us some examples?

Christina "Tina" Meerloo: 10:49

Yes, absolutely. So I think one of the most impactful things about boudoir is being able to choose how your body is being viewed. Something that I see a lot of in my industry or see a lot of in my work is, you know, humans coming to me and saying, "I've never felt sexy. I have never felt sensual. I don't know how." And my answer to that is always, everybody's sexy looks different. Everybody's embodied looks different. So my goal is to just lead them to the mirror so that they can truly see themselves. And just in the act of being able to see an embodied version of yourself in an image is healing. Because so many of us are so incredibly hard on ourselves, and we have, you know, we subscribe to these lies that we are told by the beauty industry and by every other industry that is trying to sell us stuff and to be able to truly see yourself in an image after years of having lost yourself or never being able to see yourself in the first place is an incredible, incredible act of reclamation. Like I said before, and in some cases, I have seen it be a renaissance and a rebirth for my clients. And the ripple effect of confidence is real. You know, they walk out of my studio, and not only do they feel beautiful, but they're telling all the people around them, "Oh, my gosh, I had this experience and I felt so gorgeous and like, I am so gorgeous." And then the people around them are saying, "Wow, she's so empowered. They're so empowered. How can I feel this way? And why don't I feel this way?" Right? So that ripple effect is super, super powerful. And I have seen the proof.

Pat Miller: 13:33

I wonder, is there a difference in the healing between someone that has never felt sexy, has never thought themselves beautiful, and the people that come to you that have trauma in their past or they're looking to reclaim their own power based on their own personal histories and things that might have happened to them? Are those different? Is one more powerful than the other? What has your experience been?

Christina "Tina" Meerloo: 13:59

Oh, gosh, that's such a hard question. Because I could never sit here and claim to understand. Well, I could never sit here and claim to heal people's trauma.

Pat Miller: 14:14

Of course.

Christina "Tina" Meerloo: 14:17

But I can hold space for them, and I can help them to see a version of themselves that they've lost. And as someone with my own trauma and my own experiences with boudoir and seeing these photographs of myself, wow, this is medicine. That's how I feel. That's why I say this is a therapeutic art experience. Right? I can't legally say this is therapy. Right? But I can say this is really powerful work that is changing how women and other humans see themselves.

Pat Miller: 14:59

Yeah. When you take the photo and they come around and see behind the camera or after the session, they get a chance to see themselves for the first time, how did they react?

Christina "Tina" Meerloo: 15:09

Oh, my gosh. I mean, usually there's a lot of gasping and a lot of, like, "Holy Christ, I can't believe it's me." And also, just like a glowing pride. Right? Because as women–and I keep saying, as women, but I really don't want to scare men away from having this experience–it's just my experience has been with women, but I do see this as a tool for everybody. So when humans look at their images in the reveal, they are usually stunned. Even people who have done this before, they are, I think, taken aback by how incredibly powerful the images make them feel.

Pat Miller: 16:03

Yeah. And let's talk about the after effect for a second. Can you think of one of your clients that you took pictures of, and they didn't have a ton of confidence, and now you're seeing them–you say a transformation. They're on to a different level now that they've had this experience. So you don't need to name them by names, but can you think of someone that you've worked with that you're like, wow, look at them go?

Christina "Tina" Meerloo: 16:25

Absolutely. I think one of my favorite, most recent clients messaged me after, right after our session. It couldn't have been more than two hours. She sent me this message that was just like, "Thank you so much. I have never felt beautiful. I have never felt sexy. And after seeing these images, I realized that I was wrong." And that in itself is like, the best review that I could ever get. Just to be able to, like I said before, lead somebody to the mirror and show them their beauty, that is, that's a huge gift for me.

Pat Miller: 17:04

Let's talk about presenting the business online and making sure that you're bringing in great customers for the business. In some areas of photography, I've heard the phrase, show what you want to shoot. How do you go about doing that as a boudoir photographer?

Christina "Tina" Meerloo: 17:22

Okay, so I think that this is a really good question specifically for boudoir photographers. Right? Because we are shooting so many bodies all the time. That's all we shoot is bodies. And so, to really show up online as a boudoir photographer who practices what they preach, I think showing every kind of body is important. And when I say every kind of body, I don't just mean black and white bodies. I mean fat bodies and–not a bad word–disabled bodies and everything in between. Right? Because so much of what we're fighting against is this idea that beauty only looks one way. And I think it's really, really important for us to walk the walk and show any possible person who's coming to us or coming to our socials that we know how to work with them.

Pat Miller: 18:30

I've heard you say in another place that you use the word legacy of a person that it's not just what they look like. You're capturing that person's legacy. What do you mean by that?

Christina "Tina" Meerloo: 18:41

Okay, so the reason I say that is because I have heard many times somebody say something like, I'm just not ready. I just need to lose five pounds. I just need to lose ten pounds. And my answer to that is, look back at your high school photos and see how–well, I'm speaking from personal experience here. When I look back at my high school photos, I realized that I was way too hard on myself, that I was adorable, and that I didn't have anything to worry about. And I wish I would have taken more photos in high school. And I don't want anybody to ever feel that way. I don't want people to look back and say, I wish I had more photos of myself in my 20s, my 30s, my 40s, my 50s, my 60s. Right? And that is why I say that boudoir and stepping in front of the camera is capturing your legacy, the legacy of your beauty, and the legacy of your story and honoring yourself as you age. Right? Because aging is a privilege.

Pat Miller: 19:57

I could hear the legacy language, as a guy, it kind of resonates with me more than some of the traditional boudoir messaging. Is this legacy concept connecting with men?

Christina "Tina" Meerloo: 20:07

You know, that's an interesting question. I actually would love to speak to my friend Neil, who focuses heavily on shooting men's bodies, and ask him that question, because I do wonder what kind of language would attract men to the boudoir industry. Because there's not many men who step in front of a camera for boudoir. But I so deeply see the value in them doing it because men want to feel beautiful too.

Pat Miller: 20:45

Yeah. And I think the legacy concept is a different type of connection. It's not just beauty. It's history and heritage and impact and power. And it resonates with me differently, if that means anything to you.

Christina "Tina" Meerloo: 20:59

I love that so much.

Pat Miller: 21:01

Yeah. Thank you. Let's talk about the power of customizing a session that making a client feel like you're existing in this time just for them. You've said several times, I hold space for my clients. What does that show them when you're holding space and customizing just for them?

Christina "Tina" Meerloo: 21:19

So one thing I love about boudoir is that I get to customize and create each session around my client. And that looks like a really great pre-session questionnaire. And then me doing the work to make sure once they get to the studio, me doing the work to make sure that they are getting what they want in terms of style and concept. Something that I do is that I customize every single session to every client, which some boudoir photographers would say, "Oh, that's crazy pants." But the way that I work is, like, I'm just an artist first, and my goal is to just always create beautiful art every single time. And I'll admit, I get bored. So I find it imperative when I'm creating these. These sessions to make each one of them unique, because not only do I want to create unique art, but I want each of my clients to feel incredibly seen.

Pat Miller: 22:39

You know, I think it's really refreshing to hear you say, yeah, sometimes I get bored. But when everything's clicking and you're doing great work, you're in the zone, what do you get out of it? As an artist? Why do you do this?

Christina "Tina" Meerloo: 22:55

Oh, my gosh. What do I not get out of it, is the question? Because it just–I mean, can you see me, like, completely light up? Like, I love it. I love how I make people feel. I love the collaborative energy that is shooting back and forth between me and a client when we're, like, in it and we're shooting, and I'm like, yes. And they're like, "Oh, my God." And it just is an exchange of energy that feeds my soul on such an incredibly deep level. I can't believe this is my job.

Pat Miller: 23:34

That's a great thing. I remember asking you, what's the one thing we got to make sure that we get into the interview? And you said that boudoir is based on the female gaze. Can you explain that concept? Because I think it's beautiful, but I want to make sure everybody hears this.

Christina "Tina" Meerloo: 23:50

Yes. I feel like I've been saying this for years, but boudoir is a type of imagery that is created for the subject of the image and not for the viewer. We are trying to get away from the idea of commodifying the subject, because in that act is the reclamation. It's the taking back of oneself. And to say that boudoir is created from the feminine gaze is to say that boudoir is created for the subject and for the person who's walking in and doing the scary thing and paying, in some cases, a lot of money to have this experience. Right? And I guess I would say that my experience as a model, which came before photography, I found a lot of the times that I was just subject matter, and that felt–that didn't always make me feel good. And so my goal is to remove the power of the viewer for my clients and to give them their power back.

Pat Miller: 25:28

And you just said it. You're performing an experience, not a photo shoot. You're giving them this time to have a different experience about who they are, their power, their image, their perception, and reclaiming themselves so they can see themselves in a whole new light. It's an experience, not a session.

Christina "Tina" Meerloo: 25:47

Right.

Pat Miller: 25:48

If someone is really interested in this now, they really want to learn more. I know there are a lot of ways that we can learn from you. Tell us about it.

Christina "Tina" Meerloo: 25:56

Okay, so I believe that I will be at Imaging in January. I'm very excited about that. Yeah. And also, I will be planning a workshop for Nanlite and that is happening in October at my studio. But for the first time ever, I am also offering one on one mentorships here in New Jersey and also in Maui, which is a special place in my heart and I absolutely love bringing people there. So I am always working on something, and if anybody has any questions or they want to talk to me or they want to be friends with me, my door is always open. I heavily believe in community, and I am always willing to be a listening ear and give my advice or whatever.

Pat Miller: 27:00

Let's be friends. Tina, thanks for coming on the show. I really appreciate it.

Christina "Tina" Meerloo: 27:03

I appreciate you so much.

Pat Miller: 27:05

Thanks for tuning in to this week's episode of The Professional Photographer podcast. Before you go, let us know what you liked about the episode. What did Tina say that made you go, oh, I never thought of it that way? Or oh, when Tina said that thing, I agree. We want to hear your comments in the comment section. We also want you to like and subscribe the show. Those acts help us know that we're going on the right path. The other thing is, if you're not yet a member of Professional Photographers of America, you're missing it. PPA offers incredible resources like equipment, insurance, top-notch education, and a supportive community of photographers ready to help you succeed. It's perfect for photographers who are serious about growing their business in a sustainable and profitable way at PPA. You belong here. Discover more about membership at ppa.com. That's PPA.com. I'm Pat Miller, founder of the Small Business Owners Community, publisher of the Small Business Summary newsletter and your host for the show. Thanks for tuning in. We'll see you here next time. Take care.