Industry Trends Series with Shawn Lee and Shola Richards

Pat Miller: 00:00

I'm Pat Miller, and this is The Professional Photographer Podcast. Welcome in to the Professional Photographer Podcast. I'm your host, Pat Miller, live from Imaging USA 2025 in Dallas. Joining me today, we're doing a special episode of the show. We're talking about United Behind The Lens, and Shawn Lee and Shola Richards are gonna be live on set talking about it. Now let's talk about the set for a second. This series of interviews is sponsored by Sony, and the gear is unbelievable. The Sony cinema line cameras are being used and the app that they're using to control the whole thing, it's just bananas. It's called Monitor & Control. It's making everything super simple. So if you do live video production, definitely check it out. Now, United Behind The Lens, it's a beautiful program designed to bring the entire photographic community together, and we've got two champions of the program on the show today. Welcome in Shawn Lee and Shola Richards. Gentlemen, great to see you. Welcome to the show.

Shawn Lee: 01:05

Pretty good, man. Thank you.

Shola Richards: 01:06

Man, so good. I'm so glad to be here. So glad to be here. Pumped.

Pat Miller: 01:09

It's a huge day. United Behind The Lens here at Imaging 2025 in Dallas. And checking the Mickey Mouse watch, we got about thirty minutes before you're on stage. Unbelievable. So, Shawn, tell us about what's gonna happen in just about thirty minutes.

Shawn Lee: 01:23

I might have to talk fast. You know? Alright, UBTL or United Behind The Lens is a new initiative by the Professional Photographers of America, and it is about embracing inclusion and building community. And so we have come a long ways for about ten years, and so now we have these new initiatives that will, I think, successfully embrace all cultures, all walks of life of people.

Pat Miller: 01:46

You mentioned it's new, but there's been a lot of investment to get to this point. Can you take us back to ten years ago when all this started?

Shawn Lee: 01:52

Oh, my god. It was just an idea. And a lot of–like, all of the the events that we've done have had a Martin Luther King Jr. centered kind of approach to things. And I think, Dr. King understood that you need everybody in order to get things to work well. It can't just be centered on one type of person, one culture of people, and so that has always been the stride. And so I think that now we are getting a momentum going. That is amazing.

Pat Miller: 02:19

Now, Shola Richards, you've literally written the book on inclusion and civility and how it can impact organizations when something like United Behind The Lens gets traction and really becomes a living, breathing part of something like PPA. Tell us how that makes this better.

Shola Richards: 02:36

I mean, first of all, I guess there's such an honor to the work that you're doing, and then for me to be able to join in United Behind The Lens shortly in thirty minutes–I'm so pumped for that. So your question, Pat, you know, it's like I feel like the way that we know that we're there and we're growing this is that when folks walk in they don't feel like, "Oh, this is for marginalized communities, or this is for people who are disabled or what have you." This is for everyone to play a role in creating a better world regardless of race, religion, sexual orientation, gender identity, etcetera. That's how we get to change the world. So when you're seeing people from all walks of life, I cannot wait to walk into this room shortly to see who's there and hopefully see this beautiful tapestry of America that we can all use, not just behind the lens, but really for the rest of the country as well.

Pat Miller: 03:24

You mentioned melting pot was the phrase that you used when we had a chance to talk before we started to roll that once it feels like that, the impact for PPA will be great.

Shawn Lee: 03:34

Oh, man. It's amazing. Right? It's a swatch of, I believe, what our nation looks like. And I think if you're going to thrive, I think in any environment or any situation, I think we gotta press outside of our comfort zones or where we initially come from. And I think once you get to learn and get to know people and where they come from, those borders, those lines that divide us tend to become thinner, and they tend to erase. Right? And that's some great stuff, man.

Shola Richards: 04:02

Cosigned.

Pat Miller: 04:06

What he said. You've seen this a lot. You know, like I say, you've written about it, and you go and you show people how this should be done. Are there themes or things that come up over and over when these types of initiatives are kicked off? Things that people misconceptions maybe people have or things that you have to address over and over?

Shola Richards: 04:21

Well, the theme that comes up consistently is that when you shrink the distance between people, as my mom would always say, it's hard to hate people from close-up. You know what I mean? So the challenge is when you see folks that you're only viewing on cable news stations or sporting events or whatever media that you consume, it's easy to be like, those people, them, and almost get into a weird twisted place where you have joy when they're harmed. Right? But when you get close to someone, that's why I love what's going on with United Behind The Lens, it's an opportunity for folks to get closer to each other and be like, "Oh, we have way more in common. We root for the same sports teams. We shop at the same grocery stores. Our kids go to the same schools. We have the same values." And that's how we get to really bring this world together. But if we stay separated, it's so much harder. So the work that's being done by Shawn and the team, I don't know, for me, it's transformative. And I think that we need more of that. I think PPA leading the way with this is quite frankly what the world needs right now more than ever.

Pat Miller: 05:16

How does it look tonight? At the program, you're gonna go perform here now, like, twenty one minutes. What is it gonna happen in the room tonight? Give us, like, a preview because, obviously, we're seeing this after the fact, but we wanna pretend that we're there. So show us what's gonna happen tonight.

Shawn Lee: 05:32

A lot of love, I think. I think everything of what Shola just said. Right? Getting up close, getting personal. Right? I think the two things that we have in common here at Imaging USA and at PPA is, one is humanity and the other is photography. Right? And the emphasis with us is on the humanity portion. And so I think we all got photography on lock. It doesn't matter where you come from, whether you're Asian, you know, Latino, white, black, whatever the case may be. The rules don't change in photography. We all have to use a camera. We all have to use the same rules. Well, if we come together in humanity and we understand that we suffer the same, right? And we are joyous the same, and we celebrate the same, and we can embrace those differences in people, then we can really get some stuff done. So what's going to happen when we get there is we'll have a melting pot of people and we will do the exercises that bring people together as opposed to pull people apart, you know? The exercises that I believe that will show folk that they have more in common than they don't, right? And those things help us to actually build a stronger community of people within the organization of the Professional Photographers of America. Because God forbid, you know, when you suffer loss or suffer death in a family, the last thing on your mind is photography. But you sure wish you had somebody that you could lock arms with no matter where they come from, no matter what they look like. Right? We all bleed red. Right? And so that's what you can expect when we get up there. It'll be light. It'll be airy. We're going to unveil something that's going to be amazing that we will all sign together as one unit of people.

Pat Miller: 07:16

You're also gonna recognize some people as well. Can you talk about that?

Shawn Lee: 07:18

Yes. We're gonna do some awards. So we've been doing this for ten years. And so there have been some people who have been on the front lines with us towing the line because I'm gonna tell you what hasn't been necessarily popular is bringing people together or getting people to leave their comfort zones. Right? But we don't do it because we're looking for something or looking for a paycheck. We do it because it's the right thing to do. And so those tend to be heavy lifts. And so, when we have walked this path, there have been some people who have walked this path with us and have done the work, and they haven't been all easy days. We're going to recognize those folk and give away some legacy awards today. Yes, so I'm excited for that. It means a lot.

Pat Miller: 07:57

That's gonna feel good.

Shawn Lee: 07:58

Yeah. It feels good. There have been people who have opened doors for me and stood in gaps. They didn't even know it, but they have held strong places in the industry of photography. They haven't been thanked for it. And I just believe that those that have come before us, we need to let them know that we honor them. We thank them for the place that they stood in and the hits that they took to allow people like me to walk through those doors.

Pat Miller: 08:21

Shola, there's something unique going on here because we all don't work for the same company. So when we get together at United Behind The Lens, something that I've observed is that sometimes photographers put the competition in front of the community aspect. So instead of going into a big company where you're gonna help them all understand they're on the same team, everyone here is not on the same team. And some people put that competition in front of the camaraderie or loving someone up close. So as you come into a room like this where it's not maybe what you're used to seeing, how does competition get in the way of us, you know, putting our arms down and getting to know one another?

Shola Richards: 08:57

It's so interesting because there's two ways that I tend to look at it. Competition is good if you're focusing on, like, competing against yourself. Right? Competing against the person you were yesterday. I wanna be a better person, better photographer than I was yesterday. That's who I'm competing against. Instead of looking at the people in the room across from me like, I gotta be better than her. I gotta be better than them. Second thing is this idea around scarcity mindset. It's like, "Oh, if Shawn gets his, then I'm not getting mine. So I gotta make sure he doesn't get his." That's the worst, most reductive way to live life. We both can eat. There's plenty for us. Right? So when I find that when I help people who are doing amazing work, that always seems to cyclically come back to me. Like, I help someone get something, they help me, we go on to help others, and it becomes this beautiful cascading effect versus zero sum. I get something, you don't, or you get something, then I don't. And I think here at PPA, what I've been seeing are folks are really leaning into the whole camaraderie collaboration aspect here from what I've seen and it's beautiful to watch. Because every conference isn't like that. Right? Most come from different companies, like, ooh, like, I go to companies and conferences, and Coke's in the room, Pepsi's in the room. They don't work together. Right? They're not like, "Hey." They're like, "What's their marketing strategy? What they doing?" So it's nice to see that camaraderie here. So we're gonna do their best work. And from what I've seen, as I said, more of it here than in any conference I've ever had a chance to really go to. I love it.

Pat Miller: 10:20

Unfortunately, the people watching aren't here. If someone wanted to live the spirit of this message of United Behind The Lens after the fact, as someone that helps people reach out and get to know people for real, any advice or guidance on someone who wants to make better relationships with people in their community or in their professional network? How could they take action at home?

Shola Richards: 10:40

The simplest thing we can do, because it's not always easy, is to really go outside of your bubble. Try to be a little bit uncomfortable. Right? So talk to someone who maybe doesn't look like you, doesn't vote like you, doesn't pray like you do, and be in their space. A lot of people are not willing to do that. Most people, most Americans, their group, their social group, is deeply homogeneous. Looks just like them, most like them do what they do, praise like they do, etcetera. Stepping outside of that comfort zone is good. So hard for a lot of people. It's a simple idea, step outside, but it's not easy. Right? So if that's one thing to do, try that. Oh, man. And it doesn't have to be like going from zero to a hundred. It's going to zero to one. Just try and go have a conversation. Smile to someone who maybe you wouldn't normally talk to. And then realize how much you have in common? Game changer if you do that.

Pat Miller: 11:27

And what you were saying, Shawn, when you do that, you feel it. You feel that you've opened a door or made an impact on someone that you didn't have a relationship with before that builds some momentum and you wanna do it more?

Shawn Lee: 11:39

Absolutely. I think, you know, if we're gonna be leaders and we're gonna understand what's right, I think we have to push outside of the things that we are used to. I think doing this work, if I wasn't willing to push outside of where I was, then I would have stopped a long time ago because I'm comfortable amongst what I'm used to. Right? But the reward is amazing. And having people approach you that don't look like you, don't come from where you come from, don't eat the same things, don't speak the same ways, but you find commonality is just unbelievable for community. And it feels great to find out that, you know, when you talk to people, you can yell. And you know me. I will yell from across the hallway. Right? To people who don't look like me, don't speak the same language, but we understand joy, Right? The same. We understand coming together, shaking hands. Right? And and feeling sorry for people when they're going through something. That's amazing feeling. That's the reason we do this, and I'm glad to be here today to see it unfold.

Pat Miller: 12:42

Let's look forward what's gonna happen in the next year with United Behind The Lens because it's not just here today. That's right. It's gonna keep on moving forward. So someone's watching this, and they wanna get involved. What can we look forward to with PPA?

Shawn Lee: 12:54

I'm so glad that you said that. There are some things that I wanna do, and we wanna be skilled in how we move forward. So one of the things that I wanna do is I wanna form a council made up of different parts of PPA. Right? All of the mixed parts of PPA that can actually inform Imaging USA and Professional Photographers of America of best practices, directions to go in. I wanna be innovative in our thinking. I want it to be young. I want it to be old, and everything else in between. Right? I think it would be really, really cool, which is what we wanna do. Also, I have a conference in mind that I wanna do, maybe an offshoot of here. Call it old school versus new school. Right? And so it's a mentorship type of program that takes all of these old seasoned, well-degreed photographers and and pairs them with very new people in the industry and puts us together so that everybody benefit. In our society, we typically throw people away. Young folk throw old folk away. Old folk think that young folk have lost their minds and all of that stuff. But we need everybody in society. And if we can find a way so that everybody benefits, it makes our industry stronger and the next generation of creatives within our industry much stronger.

Shola Richards: 14:11

Speak on it. Well said. Well said.

Pat Miller: 14:13

There's a lot going on with United Behind The Lens, and we're gonna put links to what they're up to on the, notes of this video. Or if you ever need to get connected, podcast@ppa.com, we can do that as well. Shawn and Shola, congratulations on a big day today. Thank you for stopping by and for being on the show.

Shola Richards: 14:30

Thanks for having us.

Shawn Lee: 14:31

Yes. Absolutely. It's amazing. Thank you.

Pat Miller: 14:34

Thanks for tuning in to this episode of The Professional Photographer Podcast. This has been the deep dive on industry trends. It's been a lot of fun. I hope you've enjoyed it. Now we're gonna gauge whether or not you enjoyed it because if you didn't enjoy it, don't click like and subscribe. But you did enjoy it, right? So you're going to click like and subscribe, right? And you're gonna leave us a comment and tell us what you liked about our guest today. That helps us and the team kinda know if we're doing the right stuff or if we need to go get a job at Dunkin' Donuts or something like that. So please leave us a comment, like, and subscribe to the YouTube channel. Also, if you're not a member of PPA, we need to have a real conversation. Because if you're trying to build a photography business, PPA is for you. We're talking top-notch equipment insurance. We're also talking about education. This show and so much more is made possible by PPA. So if you like getting better at photography, PPA is there for you as well, not to mention the sense of community with photographers that are all trying to get better and build their business. At PPA, you belong here. Register now and sign up for the group, PPA.com. That's PPA.com. Thanks for tuning in to The Professional Photographer Podcast. I'm Pat Miller. We'll see you right here next time. Take care.