Industry Trends Series with Yuliya Panchenko

Pat Miller: 00:00

I'm Pat Miller, and this is The Professional Photographer Podcast. Welcome to The Professional Photographer Podcast. And this is special because we are live at Imaging USA in Dallas. I'm your host, Pat Miller. This is the deep dive on industry trends series presented by Sony. In a moment, Yuliya Panchenko is gonna come on and talk about the hot trend of boudoir photography. But before we go there, we gotta talk about this set. High five to Sony for setting us up. We're using their cinema line cameras and their Monitor & Control app. You would be shocked at how few wires are hanging around this studio. It's working great. A big thanks to Sony for setting us up with all the good stuff so we could record here at Imaging. So the trend, boudoir photography. You're seeing it everywhere, but what is it really about? You're gonna love this conversation with Yuliya because it's not just about beautiful people and not a lot of clothes. It goes way deeper than that. And on today's show, she's gonna talk through how she works with a subject and how much craftsmanship goes into this style of photography. I mean, think about it. It's someone laying there, and they don't have a lot of wardrobe, so you have to be an expert at posing and lighting, and also the psychology of what's going on in one of these sessions. If you wanna become a boudoir photographer or you are one and you wanna get better, you're gonna love this episode. So let's bring her in now. Now, Yuliya Panchenko, welcome to The Professional Photographer Podcast. How are you today?

Yuliya Panchenko: 01:35

Doing good. Thank you for having me.

Pat Miller: 01:37

Oh, I'm excited to have you because we're talking industry trends, and one of the big ones right now is boudoir photography. So tell me about what you're seeing in the industry with that as a trend.

Yuliya Panchenko: 01:47

It is indeed a trend, and I think because boudoir photography evolved over time. There are more reasons why women do boudoir sessions. There are more women actually who want to do those boudoir sessions. And I remember when I was starting out as a boudoir photographer, one of the main reasons why my clients wanted to do boudoir shoot was just to do a nice, special gift for their significant other that could be anniversary gift or a bridal gift. But boudoir photography evolved over time, and there are bigger and deeper, I would say, reasons why people do it today. And those reasons could be healing process, going through some challenges in their lives, such as divorce, difficult breakups, health issues, body insecurities. And we, boudoir photographers, help those women to go through all these problems in their lives and then help them to heal through boudoir photography. So I believe that, again, boudoir photography changed over time, evolved over time. So, as the styles of boudoir photography also changed, and there are so many styles within the industry, within the genre, actually. And I think one of the biggest trend now within boudoir genre is that it becomes a little bit the images are leaning more towards tasteful, elegant, and, again, because women, they do that, mainly not as a gift for significant others, but for themselves. And there's so many clients. Actually, this past year, 75% of my clients came to my studio telling me the reasons why they wanted to do the blue hour session, and majority of those stories and the reasons were filled with challenges in their lives. One of the clients that I photographed, she was diagnosed with breast cancer, and she said, both of my breasts are going to be removed in two weeks. So I wanna do this boudoir session to remember the beauty of my body. Yes. It was a very challenging photo session for both of us, but those images became the most valuable memories of her body. Another client, she came, she actually had her implants removed. And for a very long time, she was feeling uncomfortable to be in front of a camera. She wasn't feeling beautiful enough, I would say. And after I did her session, she realized actually how beautiful she is, and the beauty of her body is her real body, not the fake body. And that helped her to bring her confidence back. I had women who came because they were going through divorce or through difficult breakups, and for them, again, it was to bring their confidence back, self-love, and to start their life from a new chapter.. But I also had a funny story. I did a workshop in the UK, and Beth, one of the photographers, one of the students, she said that her client, she broke up with her boyfriend, and she just wanted to prove him with doing this photo session what he lost. And two weeks later, she called the photographer saying that they got back together because she sent him the images, and she impressed him again. And they got back together. So, yeah, it's different today, and I'm glad that I made positive impacts on so many women's lives through my boudoir photography.

Pat Miller: 05:50

It's so trendy. Do you think people that aren't doing it understand how much depth and meaning goes into these shoots, or they just see good-looking people without a lot of clothes on and they just gloss right past it?

Yuliya Panchenko: 06:00

Well, women, they do understand, but many companies in the industry, there's still stigma that exists, and they associate boudoir photography with some sort of, with an image of a woman feeling sexy lying on the bed in some sort of crazy pose with her legs up. And it's they don't understand what lies behind all the sessions. They don't know the stories of my clients, so they still don't accept boudoir photography as a genre, as a trendy genre in photography industry.

Pat Miller: 06:43

You mentioned that it changed. Why did it change? What do you, you know, attribute that change to that it used to be one way, and now it's a personal interaction with every client that has all of these different personal and important meetings. When did you observe the change, and why do you think it happened?

Yuliya Panchenko: 07:00

You mean why it shifted from one purpose to another?

Pat Miller: 07:06

Yeah. It evolved over time. Why do you think it evolved over time?

Yuliya Panchenko: 07:10

Because people start understanding it's a healing process. It's a process of bringing the confidence back, so that healing process helped them to see themselves in a different light. And that's why many women started realizing that it helps them and started–people are sharing stories, people sharing experiences, and more and more women want to do that type of sessions.

Pat Miller: 07:39

Yeah. Let's talk about starting a session or the pre-session with someone. They come in. They wanna do a session with you. How do you begin the conversation, and how do you start to understand what their purpose is for doing a session with you?

Yuliya Panchenko: 07:53

I always start my session with hair and makeup. It's a whole experience for my client. So we start with hair and makeup, and they usually start opening up during the makeup session. I ask, what is the reason behind the session? Why did you decide to do that? Or my makeup asked that question. And they started opening up and telling and sharing the story, so that's how I find out the actual reason behind the photo session. And I'm telling you, 75%, they came to my studio with those stories, with the different reason than just to do a gift for a significant other.

Pat Miller: 08:31

Yeah. When you do these sessions and you're learning about why they're there, the insecurities must pop up. I mean, when I sit down for a headshot, I've got a split eyebrow and I still freak out about it. If you were shooting me with no clothes on, I'd have like Santa's Christmas list of reasons why I would not wanna do that. How do you deal with people and their insecurities? Because I'm sure you address that or have to address that when you do the shoots.

Yuliya Panchenko: 08:55

Yeah. I do boudoir and nude photography. And especially with nude photography, there is nothing to hide. So, as a professional photographer, we have to learn, master posing and lighting. And to make sure that she looks her best, I have to pose her in a way that it would emphasize only the beautiful–it will emphasize the curves and the lines of her body, and then I have to make sure that I use the lighting that also hide imperfections and highlight the best features of her body. So we need to master that. We need to learn that in order to create that elegant image. And because the reasons behind boudoir sessions are different today, women want to see themselves elegant. It's, again, not about looking sexy. It's about seeing yourself from a different perspective, from a different angle. And I have to make sure they look their best. So I would say posing and lighting is very important for boudoir photography because there is little to hide, so you have to make sure you know what you do. And you know how to direct. You know how to talk to your client to make sure that they feel comfortable around you. Make sure you don't say anything stupid around or touch the–talk about something that will make them feel even more insecure.

Pat Miller: 10:28

When you're looking at the subject, you can tell if they're present and if they're comfortable. If they're still holding on, even in a pose that you know will make them feel beautiful or look beautiful, do you talk them through so they feel beautiful? Because I would imagine there's a difference in your lens if they're feeling beautiful even if they already look beautiful.

Yuliya Panchenko: 10:49

So when I start my session, I go through the flow of different poses, and then I have to make sure they see them. Like, I show them the photographs to make sure, just to create that, oh, wow. This is me. To get a little bit motivated and feel beautiful. Because when they see that they look their best in the camera, they feel more comfortable and confident in front of the camera. So that helps a lot. So I have to make sure that the very first couple of poses that I'm going for, in those poses, they will look their best. And then it will go smoother throughout the session.

Pat Miller: 11:30

You take the first photo, and you do one of the poses that you know is gonna hit for them, and you show them. How do they react when they see themselves in a way that they don't believe that they look? How, like, what is their reaction like?

Yuliya Panchenko: 11:42

Reactions are usually like, "Oh, wow. Is it me?" And even, you know, we, women, we all have insecurities. Even if we look perfect in somebody else's eyes, we still find something to say, oh, I'm –this is not, perfect. That body part is not good enough. And I photographed gorgeous women. To me, they look perfect. Everything is looking perfect. And then I photographed them, and they still say, "Oh, just make sure that part of the body is looking good because I'm not sure if I'm happy with that.' And when I show them, like, what are you talking about? And I show them the images like, "This is me?" It's like, yes, because we don't stand in front of the mirror in a pose with the light that would highlight all the best features of your body. And maybe we don't see it. Nobody shows us. But, yes, this is you, and you're perfect. And that helps them to establish and bring that confidence back and show it then to their significant other and feel even more confident in their relationships.

Pat Miller: 12:48

Yeah. That was so gracious, and naturally, you just like you just did a little pose right there. It was fantastic. Alright. You touched on something that I think is super interesting. The craftsmanship that's required because you don't have the luxury of elaborate outfits. You really have to be a master of lighting and very little else. Is that harder for you to do? Is it more of an emphasis on posing and set design? Talk to us about that.

Yuliya Panchenko: 13:14

When I started out, I was so nervous because I didn't know much about posing and lighting. We start from somewhere. Right? We all have been there. And I was really focusing on my set design. I thought I needed a fancy chair, fancy room, just because I wasn't sure if the subject was gonna look the best. So at least there's some distraction in the image, and the rest will look the best. But then I realized none of that matters. If you know actually how to pose your subject, she will look or your image will look great even if you photograph her in front of the backdrop or in an empty room. So if you know how to pose and how to create beautiful lighting, then I think any photograph will look gorgeous, especially if you're working with a woman because female's body is beautiful.

Pat Miller: 14:12

Yeah. How often are you educating yourself? How many classes do you take? How many books do you read? Do you ever stop learning?

Yuliya Panchenko: 14:18

No. And photography industry, many, actually, regular people, clients, they think it's so easy to be a photographer. You just grab a camera, click on shutter, and there you are with the great image. No. We constantly have to educate ourselves, take workshops, learn. And there are actually so many resources now available for us, YouTube, different educational platforms. There are so many resources that we can learn from. So it's easier now than before. So that's why we have so many great photographers now.

Pat Miller: 14:55

That's right. Well, let's talk about that because you can go on YouTube and learn something, and images are becoming more and more plentiful. It's easier to make an image or to become a photographer and make your own images. How are you thinking about standing out in this sea of content that is now out there, and what would you recommend for someone that's trying to make their own mark in the industry?

Yuliya Panchenko: 15:17

So that's what I did actually with my boudoir photography. All my neighbors, photographers are doing boudoir photography now, pretty much everyone. I was shocked. Recently, I was just googling boudoir photographer near me, and I noticed that people who were not doing boudoir photography are now boudoir photographers. I was like, wow. That was a quick transition from, let's say, wedding or newborn to boudoir photography. But yeah, you're right. Everyone can learn anything in our days, and it's very important to differentiate yourself from others. So I think the style you create for yourself or you go for is one of the ways to differentiate yourself. So I created my style. I do nude photography, and not many people do that. And I do fine art nude bodyscape photography, images that they can actually print big, put it on the wall, and I create pieces of art for them with their own body. And they love to see those images on the walls because when somebody else will walk into that room, they would just think, "Oh, this is a great photograph, artistic photograph." They wouldn't even think that's them because it's just part of the body. All of my clients who came to my studio, I asked them, what is the reason why you picked me? There are so many other photographers. They said, just because you do fine art, nude, and bodyscape photography, we really love that style, we decided to go with you. So I realized, yeah, you have to differentiate yourself with some specific style, something that other people, they don't do, and offer that to attract those type of clients.

Pat Miller: 17:06

Sure. We talked about all the images that are coming. I don't wanna spend too much time on AI, but I do wanna ask about editing. So you do a session, you make someone look beautiful in the camera. How often are they asking you to make that look better or manipulate that in post-production? Does that happen, and do you do it?

Yuliya Panchenko: 17:23

Thank goodness, they don't.

Pat Miller: 17:25

Oh, good. Alright.

Yuliya Panchenko: 17:27

They don't. Yeah. I was blessed. They don't ask to do anything crazy. And my goal is, again, to create an image that looks good in camera, which is why I pay so much attention to posing and lighting. I sell images right after the session, so I want to make sure they look their best in camera. So I pay attention to every single body part, how I position it. So I'm not a fast shooter. I take it slowly. I build pose. I start from legs then arms and so on and so forth. Make sure everything looks great, I photograph. And I would say 80% of the photographs that I achieve during the session, they love. So, as a photographer, I have to make sure I pose them in a way that their body looks the best. I don't have to do any type of manipulations. But I also say, yeah, if there's any blemishes, anything that you want me to remove, I can do that. That's not a problem. And then we discuss that and I do. But nobody asked me so far to do something, like, make me taller or do my jawline, completely reshape my face, or make my eyes bigger. No. But I've heard that some photographers experience that, portrait photographers, headshot photographers. And I've heard that clients were maybe too inspired by AI, or images that they could achieve with some crazy softwares available to them. And they wanted to look the same way. And when they received an actual image with the actual look, they were not happy. So it's actually happening in the industry. I'm waiting for this to happen to me one day because I'm pretty sure I meet that client who would say the same, but thank goodness it hasn't happened yet.

Pat Miller: 19:22

Let's give you the last word on boudoir photography. It is trendy right now. Your work is beautiful. If someone wants to improve their work and really be serious about doing the style of photography, what would be your last words of wisdom or advice to someone that wants to follow in your footsteps?

Yuliya Panchenko: 19:39

Finding your style would be one of the recommendations. Paying attention to posing, that would be another. I think posing plays a huge role in boudoir photography. You can make your client either look their best or make them feel even more insecure about their bodies. And I've heard those stories as well. Unfortunately, it happened to some women, and they said, "I felt even worse after I see myself in the camera." So, yeah, finding your style would be one of the recommendations.

Pat Miller: 20:19

Fascinating discussion. Yuliya Panchenko, thank you for coming on The Professional Photographer Podcast.

Yuliya Panchenko: 20:23

Thank you so much.

Pat Miller: 20:24

I really appreciate it.

Yuliya Panchenko: 20:25

Thank you for having me.

Pat Miller: 20:26

Thanks for tuning in to this episode of The Professional Photographer Podcast. This has been the deep dive on industry trends. It's been a lot of fun. I hope you've enjoyed it. Now we're gonna gauge whether or not you enjoyed it because if you didn't enjoy it, don't click like and subscribe. But you did enjoy it. Right? So you're going to click like and subscribe. Right? And you're gonna leave us a comment and tell us what you liked about our guest today. That helps us and the team kinda know if we're doing the right stuff or if we need to go get a job at Dunkin' Donuts or something like that. So please leave us a comment, like, and subscribe to the YouTube channel. Also, if you're not a member of PPA, we need to have a real conversation. Because if you're trying to build a photography business, PPA is for you. We're talking top-notch equipment insurance. We're also talking about education. This show and so much more is made possible by PPA. So if you like getting better at photography, PPA is there for you as well, not to mention the sense of community with photographers that are all trying to get better and build their business. At PPA, you belong here. Register now and sign up for the group ppa.com. That's ppa.com. Thanks for tuning in to The Professional Photographer Podcast. I'm Pat Miller. We'll see you right here next time. Take care.